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Exponentially Grow Your Business Using Facebook Ads with Claire Pelletreau

Episode 38: Exponentially Grow Your Business Using Facebook Ads with Claire Pelletreau

Facebook ads can be explosive for your digital products business. But figuring out how to use them in a profitable way can be like trying to solve a jigsaw puzzle. 

It doesn’t have to be that way! 

In this episode of the Empowered Business podcast, we are chatting with Claire Pelletreau about how to make Facebook ads simple and profitable! 

Claire Pelletreau is a Facebook and Instagram ad expert and conversion optimization expert. Her mission is for you to actually see a return on the money you’re putting into the Zuckerberg machine without the expensive help of an outside ad consultant. 

Fortunately, Claire’s ad trainings are famous around the interwebs for being ridiculously easy to understand and implement.

Claire also LOVES talking about money – profit, loss, the whole shebang. She asks her guests how much they charge – and how much they earn – on her show, the Get Paid Podcast.

In Today’s Episode We Discuss:

  • The importance of getting clear on your marketing
  • How Facebook ads can help your business
  • What Facebook ads can and can’t do for your business
  • The importance of creating an offer that will convert
  • Monitoring your cost per lead
  • Testing the top of your funnel before you build out the rest
  • Creating conversion focused copy
  • Changing your business and focusing on your passions
  • Getting paid to test your bigger offer
  • How to succeed with small offers by upselling

 

Claire knows exactly what works with Facebook ads and what doesn’t, so I am so glad she joined me to spill all the juicy details.

I hope you feel more equipped to take on Facebook ads after listening and that you check out the resources from Claire linked below!

Don’t forget to sign up for the free Passion to Profit Experience training if you are looking for your unique million dollar formula to create digital products that sel!

Resources Mentioned:

EBP Ep38 edited_mixdown.mp3

Speaker1: [00:00:04] You are listening to the Empowered Business podcast. I’m your host, Monica Fros, a mom of two and your secret weapon to creating a six figure digital product business. I’m on a mission to help 1000 women make one hundred thousand a year. That’s right, one hundred million dollars towards financial independence for women. As an online business expert, I am teaching you everything I know right here week after week, so you can join us on the journey to one hundred million dollars. Sound good? Then let’s jump in. There’s always that moment when you remember where you were when something big happened in your life. And my guest today is part of that moment for me and she didn’t even know it. So today I’m talking to Claire Pelletreau, and she is the host of a amazing podcast called the Get Paid podcast, where she asks really tough questions out of entrepreneurs really peeling back the onion on things that we hear in the industry that aren’t always true.

 

Speaker2: [00:01:15] Like, was your launch

 

Speaker3: [00:01:17] Truly a six figure launch? And she asks the hard questions.

 

Speaker1: [00:01:20] And back in 2015, I remember driving to my first mom conference by myself and bingeing her podcast, and I said to myself, one day I’m going to get on her podcast. And then about two years ago, I was fortunate enough to meet her and she invited me on her podcast. So it felt like this full circle. And now I have a podcast and I’m inviting her on. And this is just such a great episode because Claire is an amazing person who has a lot of knowledge. Her expertize is actually in Facebook ads, so Claire is a Facebook and Instagram ad expert in conversion optimization expert. Her mission is for you to actually see a return on the money that you’re putting into the Zuckerberg machine without the expensive help of an outside ad consultant. Fortunately, Claire’s ad trainings are famous around the interwebs for being ridiculously easy to understand and then implement. Claire also loves talking about money, which includes profit, loss and the whole shebang. She asks her guests how much they charge and how much they earn on her show,

 

Speaker3: [00:02:21] The Get Paid podcast.

 

Speaker2: [00:02:22] So let’s turn

 

Speaker1: [00:02:23] The tables now

 

Speaker3: [00:02:25] And interview Claire. Claire, welcome to the Empowered Business podcast.

 

Speaker4: [00:02:30] Thank you so much for having me, Monica. I’m excited.

 

Speaker3: [00:02:33] I am very excited. And after you answer my first question, I’m going to tell everyone why I’m excited that you’re on the podcast, but we always get started with explaining your entrepreneurial journey basically, like why you’re an entrepreneur or how it started and then what you’re working on today.

 

Speaker4: [00:02:50] Ok, I never thought I would be an entrepreneur growing up. Like, I figured I’d be a social worker, a teacher, maybe a lawyer or something like that, like every single other person in my very extended family, but I found myself teaching English in Argentina like to escape the real world, and I met the man who would eventually be my husband. And he helped me transition from like running around the city, teaching English classes all over the place, making. I mean, OK, money to freelancing and then working for his startup. So that’s I like, entered the startup scene. That’s how I learned about like Facebook ads and Google Analytics and and more about blogging. But then when we realized that we wanted to stay together and therefore we couldn’t work together, I started looking for a full time job.

 

Speaker2: [00:03:40] But we were. I forget we were in

 

Speaker4: [00:03:43] Chile and then we were about to go to Spain with like his work that I had to get something online. I had to find some kind of remote job and that’s where I landed at L.A. social media, which eventually pivoted to the social media scheduling tool. Meet Edgar, so I feel like I got my master’s degree in online business. I had not heard of B School. I thought entrepreneurship was like tech startups and you have to code something. If you’re not a developer, you’re screwed. So when I started learning about online courses,

 

Speaker2: [00:04:17] It was fascinating,

 

Speaker4: [00:04:19] And this was a time where Facebook ads were just starting to become really a thing. And about 14 months into my job there, I had already started running ads for people on the side because this was just like it was the thing I loved. Well, then I got fired, and that was super smart because my boss could see I was basically starting a job on the side and she needed a different kind of person in her company. So I looked around.

 

Speaker2: [00:04:48] I cried real

 

Speaker4: [00:04:49] Bad, and then I looked around for about five minutes online for jobs. I think at this point, yeah, at this point I’m back in Argentina and I was like, All right, we’re going to make a go of this. And I just start looking for more clients that one retainer client I have at the time lasted

 

Speaker2: [00:05:05] One month, so I

 

Speaker4: [00:05:07] Had to go at it fast. But I actually ended up launching my Facebook ads course fairly quickly for like a quote unquote new entrepreneur. And then I just went back and forth between selling courses, running ads, selling courses, running ads. And at this point, I no longer run ads for anyone except for kind of my friends. I just can’t get away from it. Monica, I love the ads manager.

 

Speaker3: [00:05:30] Well, OK, you taught me Facebook ads, which I welcome. Thank you. Yeah, you’ve made me hundreds of thousands of dollars.

 

Speaker2: [00:05:38] So yeah, thank you.

 

Speaker3: [00:05:41] Ok. What year was it when you got fired? Essentially.

 

Speaker4: [00:05:47] 20 14.

 

Speaker3: [00:05:48] Ok, so when when did you put out the Facebook ads course for the first time,

 

Speaker4: [00:05:54] September 20 14?

 

Speaker3: [00:05:56] Ok, so like pretty quick after. Wow. Because I bought it. I’m pretty positive. I bought it in like. Who? You know, it was twenty sixteen summer of twenty sixteen, and I feel like I paid one ninety seven or two ninety seven.

 

Speaker4: [00:06:10] Monica, I want to look it up, but no, you know what? You probably got it in twenty sixteen.

 

Speaker3: [00:06:19] The other in Columbus, when I got it, it’s so weird, I have like a visual memory with things I’ve done related to Claire. It’s a little creepy. So I was telling Claire This is Claire is like the like the the beginning drug to my entrepreneurship almost so I didn’t even know it. How bad is this? I didn’t really know what podcasts were. I mean, I’ve heard the term. I got the gist, but I never listened to podcasts until I really started, like really wanting to quit my corporate job. And you were one of the first podcasts that I found. Of course, I found like the typical Amy Porterfield podcast and all that,

 

Speaker2: [00:06:50] But I

 

Speaker3: [00:06:50] Binged yours on a road trip. I live in Buffalo. I was going to Pittsburgh, so it’s like three and a half hour drive. I was by myself because I was going to like my first mom conference and I binge your episodes and I loved them and I said, I’m going to be on this girl’s podcast because she’s amazing. But of course, you have to like, have made money to do that. So like, I knew I had a I had a road ahead of me, but that was like my intro into following you. And I remember buying the Facebook ads course and not telling my

 

Speaker2: [00:07:16] Husband because like, I was

 

Speaker3: [00:07:17] Nowhere near ready to run Facebook ads or on Facebook ads, too. But it was like, I just knew that I would need it, and it was in twenty seventeen that I went to a mastermind. And so I was away for three days and I said, I am going to learn Facebook ads. I’m going to take Claire’s course. I dedicated my three days to it, and at the end of that, I had launched my first ads and now I’m like an ad addict. You know, so yeah,

 

Speaker2: [00:07:42] You did you.

 

Speaker3: [00:07:43] You taught me, you taught me Facebook ads. So it was very fascinating.

 

Speaker4: [00:07:47] I love to hear it. You were some of like, you know, just reading your posts about the success of your ads were were so great because the problem with ads, I mean, this is anything that you teach, right, is what percent of your students are really, really going to be successful. Well, for a lot of courses, it has to do with, like the work that they put in with Facebook. Oh my gosh, I’m holding back on the expletive so bad because every time I think about this stuff, it just makes me want to curse. But yeah, like there’s there’s so much that you and I and all my students have zero control over, right? So it just kind of makes those wins extra sweet.

 

Speaker2: [00:08:29] Like not

 

Speaker4: [00:08:30] Only does Monica have like great offerings,

 

Speaker2: [00:08:33] But the Zuckerberg

 

Speaker4: [00:08:34] Gods actually smile upon her and her out account and you know, she’s making money.

 

Speaker2: [00:08:40] So that’s what I was happy about.

 

Speaker3: [00:08:42] Well, and at the time too, I remember oh, like pixel issues I’d run into. I had nowhere else to ask questions.

 

Speaker2: [00:08:47] I was always asking

 

Speaker3: [00:08:48] Questions in your group. And I always got responses and you were thorough. And you know, you don’t find that in every course. As you know, we both know

 

Speaker2: [00:08:58] And I paid

 

Speaker3: [00:09:00] You once like one ninety seven, you know, that’s pretty. That’s pretty incredible. And I’m forever grateful for that.

 

Speaker2: [00:09:06] So thank you. Ok.

 

Speaker4: [00:09:08] That’s not the price anymore.

 

Speaker3: [00:09:11] No, it’s not. And it shouldn’t be. It shouldn’t be. Because because ads are complicated and you know, my audience knows that I used to teach the Pinterest ads for four years. And, you know, teaching ads to me just became a lot. And I have podcast episodes about why I pivot it and all that.

 

Speaker2: [00:09:28] But you know,

 

Speaker3: [00:09:29] It was like constantly, I’m sure you feel this way teaching it. It was constantly being at the mercy of something I had no control over. And on top of that, I’m also trying to get people results. And it became like a pressure cooker that I just wanted out of. To be honest with you, have you felt that way with teaching it?

 

Speaker4: [00:09:45] Absolutely. And there are things that I have

 

Speaker2: [00:09:49] Done to

 

Speaker4: [00:09:50] Feel less of that. One is I’ve had to just like work on being detached from other people’s outcomes. You know, it is hard. And also getting really clear in my marketing

 

Speaker2: [00:10:05] And I think I’ve done this in like my overall brand.

 

Speaker4: [00:10:09] Also on the sales page of all, my stuff is like, here’s who this will work for, who this will likely work for, and it’s not a silver bullet. Facebook ads are, I always say, Facebook ads are like Viagra. They will give you a boost, but they will not make you good in bed. So if your business rate is not, your business is not good in bed yet, you can’t convert because you just haven’t. You haven’t gotten there yet. And guess what? I was there, too. I was the one on webinars not selling anything. I was the one sending out emails that didn’t get opened or didn’t get clicks. It’s once you like, nail down how to sell, that ads will give you that boost, you know, so get good in bed people and then turn on the ads.

 

Speaker3: [00:10:57] And so this was my major issue with Pinterest ads. Students would come without a converting funnel, and it was the most painful thing ever, and it was so out of the scope I couldn’t teach you how to have a converting offer. And of course, it was meant for Pinterest ad. And we tried so many times to fill this gap. We even launched a whole new product about it, but it got to the point where I

 

Speaker2: [00:11:17] Just burned out

 

Speaker3: [00:11:18] On. Interest in general, I mean, really, because now what we teach

 

Speaker2: [00:11:21] Is to

 

Speaker3: [00:11:21] Create this converting funnel because it was so aggravating watching people put money down the drain and it was like that, like it wasn’t my job to really review their funnel, but almost every ad review turned into telling them, OK, it’s not the ad. It’s like, we got it. It was like a funnel review every time because, you know, without it, convert it, please. That is the biggest PSA that

 

Speaker2: [00:11:43] We could give.

 

Speaker3: [00:11:44] Please do not run ads without it converting. Offer that you’ve proven leave.

 

Speaker4: [00:11:48] Ok, and can I piggyback on that? Yes. I don’t know what you do with your

 

Speaker2: [00:11:54] Students, but

 

Speaker4: [00:11:56] I have a new soapbox that I’m on.

 

Speaker3: [00:11:59] Oh, I want to hear.

 

Speaker4: [00:12:01] Seven days a week. Twenty four hours a day, which is

 

Speaker2: [00:12:05] Do not build a funnel without testing

 

Speaker4: [00:12:08] The top of it with ads.

 

Speaker3: [00:12:10] Interesting. Ok, tell me more.

 

Speaker4: [00:12:13] Let me tell you, so I have this evergreen funnel.

 

Speaker2: [00:12:15] All right.

 

Speaker4: [00:12:16] It’s a webinar

 

Speaker2: [00:12:16] Funnel. It converts.

 

Speaker4: [00:12:18] It’s beautiful. It changed my life, right? I get five to 10 sign ups for that funnel, or some some opt in on my site a day, right? I have Google traffic that’s not a ton, right? But from that I was making four to eight sales a month from organic traffic. Guess who spent more than twenty thousand, probably closer to thirty thousand, trying to make that funnel profitable with ads? This girl, because I was I, was like fiddling with everything. Monica, I was improving and paying copywriters to improve the sales page, improve the emails.

 

Speaker2: [00:13:04] I don’t even think

 

Speaker4: [00:13:05] I actually touched the webinar itself,

 

Speaker2: [00:13:08] But what I

 

Speaker4: [00:13:09] Kept seeing was that I could

 

Speaker2: [00:13:10] Not get

 

Speaker4: [00:13:11] The cost per lead down on the actual sign up for the webinar.

 

Speaker2: [00:13:16] So the math just didn’t work out.

 

Speaker4: [00:13:20] Even if I had like a one percent conversion rate, my cost per lead was so high that I wasn’t going to make very much money on these ads. I did get it to break. Even the price of the course had gone up and up like to make that happen. Also, we had a pandemic and people

 

Speaker2: [00:13:36] Started like, I need

 

Speaker4: [00:13:37] Ads,

 

Speaker2: [00:13:38] But what I

 

Speaker4: [00:13:39] Never tested was changing the name of that webinar. The five ad

 

Speaker2: [00:13:44] Formula to

 

Speaker4: [00:13:46] Sell online courses on autopilot snooze. Ok?

 

Speaker2: [00:13:52] People wouldn’t click.

 

Speaker4: [00:13:54] I know how to run ads and I couldn’t get my class lead down.

 

Speaker2: [00:13:56] It’s because of the offer.

 

Speaker4: [00:13:59] All right. So about thirty thousand in all those tests to be at the end break even with like people buying later and launches or things like that. Last week, I built a quiz in a day, in another hour. I had ads

 

Speaker2: [00:14:14] Running to it. One hundred and

 

Speaker4: [00:14:15] Fifty dollars,

 

Speaker2: [00:14:16] I spent to learn

 

Speaker4: [00:14:17] That this is also

 

Speaker2: [00:14:19] Not the top of the funnel. I didn’t build any emails.

 

Speaker4: [00:14:23] The responses to the quizzes were like super basic, OK, one hundred and fifty dollars and about three hours. I realize this is not the thing. So the things that work for organic traffic do not always work for ads. And that’s why my clients, they test the top of their funnel before they build out anything else with ads.

 

Speaker3: [00:14:43] Ok, I like that. No, that is a very, very strong point, and I’ve never thought of it like that before, but I always appreciate when someone comes in and is able to give me a different way of looking at it. And I understand what you’re saying. I do. And well, I was going to say like how people find you organically too. I think does does matter as well. Like, I have a very strong, warm audience and I know. As I’ve seen it many times, how what my audience responds to is not the same thing as cold ads for me, it’s like I do know that. And I guess it’s like some qualification of like, what

 

Speaker2: [00:15:19] Do you consider like warm,

 

Speaker3: [00:15:20] Like someone on my email list who’s engaged with me is warmer than someone who might have found me

 

Speaker2: [00:15:25] On Google likely.

 

Speaker3: [00:15:27] You know, so.

 

Speaker4: [00:15:29] No, you’re absolutely right. The funnel. It’s not as if the

 

Speaker2: [00:15:32] Ads, the ad traffic

 

Speaker4: [00:15:34] And the organic traffic converts at the

 

Speaker2: [00:15:35] Same rate.

 

Speaker4: [00:15:36] Not at all. Right? Two to three percent on organic and probably people. People recommend me and Facebook groups. There is a lot of Google traffic, which is not high quality. So certainly there are different conversion rates, but I know that I don’t want to be blogging constantly. I don’t want to be on that content creation hamster wheel. I love my podcast, but even recording two episodes a month sometimes makes my schedule a little unbearable. So I want my business. My leads to at least break even from ads. So that I don’t really have to worry

 

Speaker2: [00:16:12] About that, and I have like I make

 

Speaker4: [00:16:14] The money off of the higher ticket thing.

 

Speaker2: [00:16:16] Ok, so you mentioned

 

Speaker3: [00:16:18] Already that don’t run ads

 

Speaker2: [00:16:19] Anymore for people

 

Speaker3: [00:16:21] Like you’ll help friends, but you’re in the teaching game at this point.

 

Speaker4: [00:16:25] Yeah, I’m in the teaching game in sort of like a little bit of the done with you, but I myself am less hands

 

Speaker2: [00:16:33] On because now

 

Speaker4: [00:16:34] I have coaches

 

Speaker2: [00:16:35] Who are doing that. I have two coaches,

 

Speaker4: [00:16:37] One who is an ad’s coach and one who is a copy coach, because that’s also what I’m sure you know about. Funnels is like the conversions really rest on super incredible copy. And that’s it’s just a hard thing to master.

 

Speaker3: [00:16:50] Oh yes, it is. Oh, and finding, I mean, outsourcing something like that. This was a recent topic that we had. We were

 

Speaker2: [00:16:58] Talking about what the next

 

Speaker3: [00:17:00] Role should be that we hire

 

Speaker2: [00:17:01] For and our needs.

 

Speaker3: [00:17:02] And one of the most prevailing needs we have is conversion focus copy. And it’s painful. It takes a toll on a small team because it just feels like it’s very draining, especially if it’s not the thing that lights you up, you know, and it’s hard to find someone that’s affordable at all levels that that’s the thing that lights them up. I mean, conversion copywriters are expensive as they should be, because they make you a lot of money.

 

Speaker4: [00:17:27] Yes. Can I tell you how I solved that problem? Oh, please. People are like, How are you getting like a conversion copywriter on your team for? Well, I won’t say how much, because it’s not my business to share what she makes, but it’s it’s not the price of a sales page. I’ll tell you that, you know, she’s in a little bit of a hybrid role where she’s a coach, so she’s not spending all of her time with me writing. She gets to flex her coaching muscles, and she’s fantastic at that. And it was just kind of like part of the job description. So, you know, you’re going to be like halftime coaching and halftime

 

Speaker2: [00:18:06] Writing, writing are

 

Speaker4: [00:18:08] Like marketing assets. So, yeah, I mean, I feel like the first month that she was with us, she wrote maybe six emails to drive applications for our program and oh my god, the ROI on that investment in her was insane. So, yeah, I was going to be hope. Yeah, no. I just like I. It is hard. In fact, that was like almost the role that I was hired for in my last job, except I had no experience with conversion copywriting. And I think that was just one of the areas where I didn’t live

 

Speaker2: [00:18:42] Up to it.

 

Speaker4: [00:18:43] Maybe another reason why I was let go.

 

Speaker3: [00:18:45] But you mentioned that you like you love the ads manager. I know we say that a little bit tongue in cheek, probably because we can also hate the ads manager, depending on the day.

 

Speaker4: [00:18:55] Well, I hate when I have to update all my courses, but if I’m just in there, I can find things. I love it. Like, I was just telling my

 

Speaker2: [00:19:02] Husband, How

 

Speaker4: [00:19:03] Can I get more involved in my clients at managers? And he was like, I think that may be a terrible idea. I don’t know.

 

Speaker3: [00:19:10] Well, OK. So but what was your driving decision to stop having clients if you love it so much?

 

Speaker4: [00:19:16] The money, the money, yeah, yeah, my favorite client who I worked with for years, even that, like I would say, she was probably taking up about a third of my headspace. Not even like on the actual work, but thinking, checking, communicating, you know? And that was not a third of my revenue by far, and I have no interest in building an agency. So in order to scale that kind of work, its agency direction,

 

Speaker2: [00:19:48] I kind

 

Speaker4: [00:19:49] Of didn’t want to just increase my prices because I could have. I was at like two thousand five hundred a month and I could have gone to three thousand, maybe even four thousand. But at that level, people are expecting images copy.

 

Speaker2: [00:20:02] I was making twenty five

 

Speaker4: [00:20:02] Hundred a month to not write any copy. I was basically the strategy and the person clicking around in the ads manager and choosing the audiences, which is so much fun.

 

Speaker3: [00:20:13] Yeah, audiences are fun. One thing I definitely like,

 

Speaker4: [00:20:16] Yeah, it’s so funny. There’s there’s like one percent of us that feel this way.

 

Speaker3: [00:20:20] Really? Oh, it’s so fun when you uncover a new one, it’s like, Oh, you can target this.

 

Speaker4: [00:20:25] I know it is really.

 

Speaker2: [00:20:27] It’s fun to

 

Speaker4: [00:20:28] See my clients when they discover their like inner nerd, when all they wanted was just more leads, you know? And then they’re like, Oh my goodness, I didn’t know I could look

 

Speaker2: [00:20:37] At that data.

 

Speaker4: [00:20:42] One hundred one and a hundred.

 

Speaker3: [00:20:43] Yeah, yeah. And you know, I think that’s kind of what makes me a good student for a lot of these courses because

 

Speaker2: [00:20:49] I like data and I’m very inquisitive and I do the work when I want

 

Speaker3: [00:20:53] Something to happen, I do the work, and a lot of people show up to courses that don’t do the work. And there’s a lot of I’m actually really on board with the fact that like, you can’t have a jump course and then blame the people who join it, like, that’s not fair. I wholeheartedly do not believe I have a jump course whatsoever. Like, I poured my heart and soul into it. I want to see people succeed. If someone’s unwilling to show up, that is on them, you know, if they don’t want to do the work and open it, open it up. And I can’t make some. We’re all adults. We have to also have, you know, our autonomy about us. And so there is like that. I’m like, I’m bored with the fact that we’re equally responsible. So when I show up, for my part, you have to show up for your part, you know, and you have a different opinion. I mean, I’m cool if you did.

 

Speaker4: [00:21:34] No, no, no, not at all. I think what I when I think about the courses that I have not. There are courses that I have bought,

 

Speaker2: [00:21:42] Not opened, right? Mm hmm.

 

Speaker4: [00:21:44] But I’m thinking one in particular, it was not a junk course. It was actually on writing Facebook ad copy because I knew that. Remember me trying to get this cost per lead down? Oh my gosh.

 

Speaker2: [00:21:55] Right.

 

Speaker4: [00:21:55] And copy is not my strong suit, so I couldn’t get through 20 minutes of the first video. It was a guy talking. It was just him talking, and the video was about an hour and 20 minutes. So that’s my learning style. Right? That’s about like I took 10 x emails from copy hackers. Mm hmm. It’s video short videos, but also you can just read the entire script.

 

Speaker2: [00:22:21] It was

 

Speaker4: [00:22:21] Wonderful. That course with the ad copy maybe

 

Speaker2: [00:22:25] Is fantastic, but

 

Speaker4: [00:22:27] I didn’t investigate. I didn’t look into whether or not it was going to match with my learning style. I probably could have requested a refund. I didn’t even read the terms.

 

Speaker2: [00:22:35] It wasn’t too expensive.

 

Speaker4: [00:22:37] So sometimes I get it. My course is not all VIDEO And some people really hate that, so I try to make a super clear on the sales page, but not, you know, people don’t always read. But one thing that I’ll say this last thing, one thing that my mindset coach has taught me is that sometimes people

 

Speaker2: [00:22:53] Need to

 

Speaker4: [00:22:54] Invest in something to learn that that’s the wrong investment.

 

Speaker3: [00:23:00] You know, I can understand that I can relate. Ok, so the other like hybrid option two is, I mean, you are in a mutual program that I have not implemented a single thing and we have paid tens of thousands of dollars to be in this program. I have no regrets whatsoever because it’s almost like the up leveling of the people that you meet. And I’ve always been a firm believer, even in my worst investments, and I’ve only asked for a refund in like seven eight years once, and I probably should have asked for refunds many more times than that. However, even in bad situations where it was like,

 

Speaker2: [00:23:36] Oh, like the

 

Speaker3: [00:23:37] Person who took the money, I don’t even know how they slept at night, like those kind of

 

Speaker2: [00:23:41] Situations. The people I met

 

Speaker3: [00:23:44] Down the road always paid off almost one hundred percent of the time, the relationships that I formed. And so there’s other things to get out of joining. It’s almost like essentially when corporate what we call buying herself into the room.

 

Speaker2: [00:23:57] Hmm. That’s a lot

 

Speaker3: [00:23:58] Of what online business is.

 

Speaker4: [00:24:00] Yes, yes, it is. And that that feels tricky. I have given that advice when I used to run this program about like building an ad management business. I remember that program. Yeah, and I. You remember doing a video about that, and I had learned that from other people, and then I saw it happen, and I had a lot of feelings about people who had just invested a significant amount with me in telling them, buy yourself into these other rooms, but especially as managers, especially people, if you are in. I mean, I realize that most of your audience are

 

Speaker2: [00:24:38] More like, you know, course

 

Speaker4: [00:24:39] Creators and things like that. And of course, creators, I love you, come learn from me, but be to be service providers by those courses. If they have a group, be active in the group, be ridiculously useful, which is my motto. And you’re going to get clients.

 

Speaker3: [00:24:54] Yeah, that’s a good. It’s a good point. Yeah, it is a tricky thing too, because, you know. When I started and when many people start, you’re not buying. Most of us are not buying ourselves into 10000 rooms. And there’s a whole separate conversation to be had about that, too. There’s a part of me that sometimes feels like I’m accepting of things because of the culture and corporate that I grew up in the that I was forced to accept in my twenties that I’m just still unraveling about really inappropriate things that

 

Speaker2: [00:25:24] Happened with men,

 

Speaker3: [00:25:26] With the power that they had that I’m not even ready to publicly talk about. I don’t know if I ever will be. Probably should go to therapy for it, and I think I actually kind of blocked

 

Speaker2: [00:25:34] It out until

 

Speaker3: [00:25:35] Recently where I’ve kind of just been unraveling a bunch of stuff in general that has happened in life and buying yourself into a room can be a symptom of the culture they’ve created that kind of seeped in. One of the saddest things for me with online business was when I left corporate, I thought I was escaping this world that was very skewed towards

 

Speaker2: [00:25:55] A certain type of person,

 

Speaker3: [00:25:56] Definitely not welcoming of working moms, which is where we’re redefining mom was born out of. And a lot of it followed me into the online business world like the way people play. The business game didn’t really change all that much, and I think that was very disheartening for me. I wanted it to be different. And I still want it to be different and like what that looks like? I don’t know. I think I’m still working on that. I guess

 

Speaker4: [00:26:20] It’s really interesting

 

Speaker2: [00:26:21] That you mentioned that a lot

 

Speaker4: [00:26:22] Of the the rooms that, like my students would buy their way into were led by white dudes. Yup. And I learned from Rachel Rogers, who I know you’re also a fan of.

 

Speaker2: [00:26:34] Mm hmm. Like, these

 

Speaker4: [00:26:35] Are not the only rooms. And that changed. That changed a lot for me because I was I was looking towards these male, these white

 

Speaker2: [00:26:44] Male leaders

 

Speaker4: [00:26:46] Mentors, and it was like,

 

Speaker2: [00:26:48] Why? There are other rooms

 

Speaker4: [00:26:52] And those rooms. Not that I’ve gotten into them have been, like incredible, more supportive, more fruitful in a way. So anyway, I just wanted to throw that out there. I know that wasn’t,

 

Speaker3: [00:27:04] Yeah, know something where we thought we go, Yeah, something weird that happened to me was I was so burned out with working with men in corporate. I had such bad experiences that I intentionally avoided them in my business. Then I entered this period where I felt like I was intimidated by men, and I said this to a peer mastermind and they all I could see all their eyes on Zoom. And they were like, Monica’s intimidated by men because I’m so loud and opinionated. And if you really know me like, I don’t hold back, typically, you know my personal life, I don’t hold back how I feel. And they’re like, You are intimidated by men. And I’m like, Yeah, it’s a real issue. So then I thought I had to hire a male coach

 

Speaker2: [00:27:40] To, like, prove to

 

Speaker3: [00:27:41] Myself, and it was actually a real bad mind game that was being played. But I will say the one thing I took away from that is there’s no need for me to be intimidated by men. It reaffirmed, though, to me that like, I don’t need to play in their same rooms or sit at their same table, which is why me and you are in like Rachel’s membership and we’re in. I try very hard to be a

 

Speaker2: [00:28:00] More diverse, by my way,

 

Speaker3: [00:28:02] Into rooms that are more diverse, which I

 

Speaker2: [00:28:05] Historically have just not

 

Speaker3: [00:28:06] Been exposed to, especially not in the tech world and corporate. And so that is encouraging. You know, that’s a good spin on how I was discouraged

 

Speaker2: [00:28:14] By this environment

 

Speaker3: [00:28:16] For a while, but now the tides are turning and that is very that is very encouraging now. Yeah, we just got to keep buying like buying into the right rooms and supporting the right people.

 

Speaker4: [00:28:27] Yeah, keep taking my money, Rachel. Yes, let’s get it on. You know, like A.C.H, whatever you want to call it,

 

Speaker3: [00:28:34] And we’ll link our link in the podcast notes to Rachel Rogers membership. She has a book too, and we’ll link to that. We should all be millionaires because we should, and she’s amazing. I have nothing but good things to say about her, and she’s taught me a lot too.

 

Speaker2: [00:28:47] So, OK,

 

Speaker3: [00:28:48] The two things I just want to I want to cover. We haven’t said it yet, but you have a podcast called the Get Paid podcast. Now we’ve mentioned, I’ve mentioned that that’s I binged your podcast. But here’s the thing. The gift paid podcast is where you ask tough questions that entrepreneurs, you want to know the nitty gritty, the stuff that nobody talks about in their marketing material, like, are your launches really profitable? Are you lying to us and you go there? But I mean, that is a disconnect. I know you’ve struggled with the disconnect between the content in your podcast to the fact that you teach Facebook ads. So you paused it. I know for about a year ish. Maybe two three. Ok? Oh wow. Ok, three years I missed you and then you brought up.

 

Speaker4: [00:29:30] You discovered it a little later, so you probably didn’t realize how long it was on how.

 

Speaker3: [00:29:34] Yeah, maybe. And I think I actually listened to episodes. So you paused it. Why did you bring it back?

 

Speaker4: [00:29:41] Well, in February, twenty eighteen, I

 

Speaker2: [00:29:45] Was in a pure mastermind

 

Speaker4: [00:29:47] Like meet up the first one had really done in New York City and in my hot seat, it became clear to

 

Speaker2: [00:29:54] Me, somebody

 

Speaker4: [00:29:55] Said somebody who I really respect said, I don’t really feel like you have a brand. And she was right. Like, I was just kind of hiding behind these tutorials. These like how Facebook, how tos. The podcast stopped when I had my first in twenty sixteen, and then I just felt like it didn’t really make me money. I had stopped blogging, which is what gave me a lot of seo juice, yada yada. It just felt

 

Speaker2: [00:30:24] Like this isn’t the thing,

 

Speaker4: [00:30:26] Because I didn’t talk about Facebook ads on it. I didn’t write. Even I never talked about me on the show. So a friend of mine later said, You know, she said two things that were really important. She said, one, you know, you can pay people to help you with branding, right? And I forget, like two years later, I think right where you and I met in person, my news site went live.

 

Speaker3: [00:30:50] It did the week that we were together.

 

Speaker4: [00:30:52] Exactly. Having spent a lot of money on branding, it was awesome. But like one year later after that mastermind because it took me a year to plan it and think about it. I brought the podcast back because that was the most

 

Speaker2: [00:31:06] Me that I

 

Speaker4: [00:31:07] Had ever been in business. And this is what my friend said to me. One of she’s the reason a hug. She’s the reason why the podcast came back. And what I just decided was that I could no longer

 

Speaker2: [00:31:18] Worry about having the

 

Speaker4: [00:31:20] Right people on the show

 

Speaker2: [00:31:22] Or like, kind of, I

 

Speaker4: [00:31:25] Just remember interviewing one of my guests and really wanting to know how she was having a sex life while being a single mom traveling around Asia. And I’m thinking, what if my listeners don’t want this,

 

Speaker2: [00:31:40] What if they’re like, we just want the

 

Speaker4: [00:31:41] Business talk, we just want the business talk? And then I was

 

Speaker2: [00:31:43] Like, Ah, I can’t

 

Speaker4: [00:31:45] Run this podcast if I can’t have the conversations that I want, it doesn’t make any sense. So from that day forward, I was just like, I’m going to ask some people about money. I’m not going to ask everyone about money, I’m going to do what I want and just have the conversations I want. And I think the show kind of really gained

 

Speaker2: [00:32:03] A lot of momentum

 

Speaker4: [00:32:06] Once I started doing that.

 

Speaker3: [00:32:08] I like that, and the other thing is to your episodes, go along and have you gotten a lot of do people criticize that? Just my husband. Oh, OK, good, because I like it, I feel like you give such good context and they’re great conversations. And, you know, if you have to know this, you can always beat us up to like I Speed Up podcast, you know, so like if you have, you just did a great episode with Jordan Gill two hours. But you know, I spend you guys up. I listened, but I spend you guys up.

 

Speaker4: [00:32:37] I mean, you didn’t listen to it in one sitting, did you?

 

Speaker3: [00:32:40] It took about two of my walks to get the bridge.

 

Speaker4: [00:32:44] That’s the thing. Like, I am much more inclined to go out on a walk or actually do the dishes without grumbling if I have great stuff to listen to. Yeah. And for me, these like twenty five minute, you know, just like little highlights, three tips to x y z. It just doesn’t do it for me.

 

Speaker2: [00:33:02] So again, I created the show

 

Speaker4: [00:33:03] That I would want to listen to,

 

Speaker3: [00:33:05] And that’s why you’re motivated to show up for it. I mean, that makes perfect sense. So now you’re honoring yourself and OK. So it was a mindset thing where you felt like you’re always kind of on guard about you wanted to please everyone almost.

 

Speaker2: [00:33:19] Yeah, that’s

 

Speaker4: [00:33:20] A story of my life right there. Monica always wanting, always wanting to please people. And and so the other thing that I changed into in 2019 is I started talking more

 

Speaker2: [00:33:29] About my work. I started promoting

 

Speaker4: [00:33:32] My own, my own evergreen webinar funnel instead of like acuity, which was my lovely sponsor for a while. But you know, that has a top once they pay you that one time, the way we had it set up, that has that has the top. So it was really funny because the month I brought back the podcast, I was like dealing with infertility. It was one of the worst months ever. I could barely get out of it, except I got out of bed for these interviews, and we launched the podcast with these ads to my funnels, and I just got this influx of sales. It was this if my listeners who actually kept the podcast in their

 

Speaker2: [00:34:08] Phones for three

 

Speaker3: [00:34:09] Years, which was one of them. No, I mean, I can see why

 

Speaker4: [00:34:13] It was as if they were like, Oh, I didn’t know. Clare knew

 

Speaker2: [00:34:16] About ads. Oh, OK.

 

Speaker4: [00:34:18] Here, take my money. I didn’t know that you did that. Oh, now that I know, here you go because it was a flood of sales.

 

Speaker2: [00:34:25] Let me thank you

 

Speaker3: [00:34:26] For this because I remember when your podcast came back because you were still in my phone and I listened to the episode where you talked about, I’m not having sponsors, I’m sponsoring my program is sponsoring

 

Speaker2: [00:34:39] This.

 

Speaker3: [00:34:39] And when I set up this podcast, I knew immediately I would not take sponsors. And I knew that the calls to action were

 

Speaker2: [00:34:47] Going to be about our business,

 

Speaker3: [00:34:50] Our funnels.

 

Speaker2: [00:34:51] And that’s because of watching you burn out.

 

Speaker3: [00:34:55] Take your break and then come back and state that. And that is why I structured this the way I did. So thank you.

 

Speaker4: [00:35:02] Oh, you’re so welcome. Do you ever run ads to episodes?

 

Speaker3: [00:35:04] I have one running right now. Yeah, I have like this whole waterfall like attempt going on where for years my unique content was being put out in two ways behind a paid firewall. I would say like eighty five percent of my effort was behind the paid firewall on my courses, and I had given up logging. So then the other effort went into my email list. Now, like four years. That was all I could. You know, I just didn’t have the bandwidth to do anything else, and my courses were making money. So this is where my attention, why so emails, though we all know like, you’re lucky if you get a twenty twenty five percent open rate and that’s probably on a weekend and it was like one day dawned on me. I’m like, So I’m writing these amazing emails, which people resonate with people. We get great

 

Speaker2: [00:35:45] Responses built, really

 

Speaker3: [00:35:46] A loyal following, but it wasn’t going anywhere. Besides, I was gated. It was gated. It was like, what? And so I wanted to launch a podcast for a very long time. But, you know, bandwidth bandwidth, it was always an issue. And then, you know, this year was like the year when we pivoted away from Pinterest ads that I was like, I have to get back, you know, without a firewall. And so now that this is like the primary mode of me putting out free content, I don’t know. It took me a while for it to dawn on me that, oh gosh, why am I not running really cheap ads to this content and then retargeting that audience with the offer

 

Speaker2: [00:36:23] Because it’ll be cheaper? My cost per

 

Speaker3: [00:36:25] Lead will be cheaper, which has proven to be true so far, but I’m very micro kind of test. I tasked my operations manager with doing new graphics for the different podcast episodes and audio games and stuff. So we’re going to we’re about to make this a much bigger thing. Yeah, but now even I think about when I go to record a solo show, I’m even thinking like, Well, what’s a good topic that we can run ads to?

 

Speaker4: [00:36:50] I have two words for you. Ok. Carousel, let’s OK. Choose your

 

Speaker2: [00:36:57] Own adventure if you

 

Speaker4: [00:36:59] Want. They could all be solo episodes if you like. I’ve done it with guests. Ok, so I pick like six episodes and I mean, the art that I use in the ad, not the art that we have like on the site or anything like that. And it’s just kind of a very click baity headline. The one that I will never forget, because this is the one that one was Jerry Hawk her. In her episode, she talked about having a 60k month from her side hustle. So the Carousel ad Facebook will show different cards in the carousel to just to test out to see which ones we’re getting the most clicks. And now, or at least until I stop running that particular ad because those episodes are so old now. Jericho’s was the one that people clicked on the most, and so that was like the cheapest. And it was. It’s a great episode. I’m great in it. Like, I talk, I actually talk about my work. And so we saw a lot of a lot of sales coming off of those ads.

 

Speaker3: [00:38:00] I love it. Ok. And I will put that in my arsenal. This is why I like talking to other

 

Speaker2: [00:38:06] Experts, you know, because when you stop

 

Speaker3: [00:38:08] Teaching it to even though I taught Pinterest and not Facebook, a lot of the data I was seeing, I don’t see now. And that’s like, I did realize what I didn’t. Well, I I realized now what I didn’t realize when I shut down the course was how much data I actually had that informed my decisions, even in my own business. And I’m like, Well, dang, now I’m just kind of like left out, left out in the past year just trying to figure out what works now, you know? So thank you. I will definitely try that. That’s a good tip. Ok, I have then one other question

 

Speaker2: [00:38:39] For you, which is when the

 

Speaker3: [00:38:42] Pandemic hit and everyone was like, Oh, so we’ve never run online businesses during a pandemic before, what’s going to happen? Correct me if I’m wrong. But this coincides with, I remember I’m almost positive, was a podcast episode you did where you talked about how your sales pretty much shut off that March, March 20, 20. It was like you were. You were getting those, you know, trickle in of your organic sales and they were adding up to a decent baseline because your course was fourteen, ninety seven, I think. Ok. You know, so eight sales times, fourteen, ninety seven, that’s not a bad baseline. And then suddenly the world shuts down and it shuts off. And you were pregnant, very pregnant.

 

Speaker4: [00:39:20] Right at the time. I was six months pregnant.

 

Speaker3: [00:39:25] Yeah. So I mean, you’re like, yeah, imminent maternity leave coming out right now. Right now, we got a pandemic going on and you made, in my opinion, a pretty genius pivot, which was into workshops.

 

Speaker2: [00:39:38] Mm hmm. Yes.

 

Speaker4: [00:39:39] So it was three weeks of no

 

Speaker2: [00:39:41] Sales, right?

 

Speaker4: [00:39:42] And it started at the very beginning of March. So we didn’t even go into lockdown until we got that 14 17 something like that, right? We’re talking about March 4th was like my last sale and then nothing. And I just didn’t know. I didn’t know what was going to happen. So I had at the time a list of, I don’t know, six thousand people and I had this course, which at the time was fifteen hundred dollars. Great course. Lots of support.

 

Speaker2: [00:40:09] But like most

 

Speaker4: [00:40:10] People on my list, we’re never going to buy that. But Facebook ads especially, I mean, suddenly costs with ads dropped. So it was just a really great time to be running ads, but not a great time to be selling a fifteen hundred dollar product with all the uncertainty. So I put together a ninety seven dollars workshop. I capped it at 30 people and I sold it out in about forty five minutes with one email to my list. Oh, one email was like a

 

Speaker2: [00:40:38] Pre like,

 

Speaker4: [00:40:39] Hey, are you interested in this? And then the next email sold it out. Ok, that’s cool. It was a three day workshop. And then I sold

 

Speaker2: [00:40:50] Five off of the back end of that, like, is the upsell.

 

Speaker4: [00:40:54] Five people took me up on the offer to join my course and then I did it again and it might have taken like two hours for the next one and

 

Speaker2: [00:41:02] It was 40 spots

 

Speaker4: [00:41:03] Instead of 30. So, yeah, in the course of about three weeks, I think I made fifteen thousand just from workshop sales and upsells. And the beauty of it, which I didn’t know this was going to happen, is that

 

Speaker2: [00:41:17] Suddenly the sales started

 

Speaker4: [00:41:19] Rushing in for my funnel again. So that was just like a nice resolution to that. But yeah, I then launched a course called Workshop Magic about how to do this. It’s a ton of email templates

 

Speaker2: [00:41:30] So that you don’t have to write all of

 

Speaker4: [00:41:32] The emails because there aren’t a ton of emails to sell it, because it’s really for somebody who has an existing audience like

 

Speaker2: [00:41:40] Monica. If you did this, you’d probably

 

Speaker4: [00:41:42] Make one hundred thousand just off of the ticket sales.

 

Speaker3: [00:41:46] We do do workshops and we do pretty well with them.

 

Speaker2: [00:41:48] Ok, great. Great.

 

Speaker4: [00:41:50] So and then I just added like when I actually went from having these self study courses to like a hybrid coaching and training program, I I put that in. So now this is this is how we get people to sort of validate an offer before they build a funnel around it. And some people, some of my students are just using it like to replace their launches because they’re making the same amount of money

 

Speaker3: [00:42:16] Off of a lot less work,

 

Speaker4: [00:42:18] A lot less work. And now that’s not to say that, you know, like I have one, I have one client who did a launch in January, and I think she was a little bit disappointed with the results. I think she brought in fifty k, but considering her audience and the work involved, right?

 

Speaker2: [00:42:35] And then she she did a ninety

 

Speaker4: [00:42:37] Seven dollar workshop plus an upsell into her 1000 course and got the exact same results.

 

Speaker2: [00:42:43] So doesn’t mean she’s going

 

Speaker4: [00:42:45] To stop launching because I think, you know, she hopes these launches will be in the six figure mark and things like that. But it’s a great way to test a low priced offer and get paid to pitch your your services or your bigger offer, your signature program. I just feel like

 

Speaker2: [00:43:04] The engagement the the

 

Speaker4: [00:43:06] Act of like getting to experience somebody live. The upsell conversion rates are just so much better than like a live webinar that you send a gazillion emails about to fill to try to get people to show up. And then there’s no real winner. It’s, you know,

 

Speaker3: [00:43:24] So we were doing, Oh man, we’re doing a lot right now. And so I’ve always wanted to do a high ticket. But I pivoted the whole suite of products and the first two rungs of the there’s three products total, which will end with the high ticket. The first two products,

 

Speaker2: [00:43:40] You know, it’s been

 

Speaker3: [00:43:41] Since last October of us getting it all up, and we’re at a good place right now with it. So I kept thinking like, Oh my gosh, I’m like, kind of burned out from all the content I just had to come up with

 

Speaker2: [00:43:51] In the last like, you know, nine months.

 

Speaker3: [00:43:54] And so I took a common approach for once and I said, OK, well, what’s going to be like the first essentially part of the framework of what my ticket’s going to be? And I’ve made it a workshop, so it’s the next logical step for current students. And I mean, there are a lot of people on my list who are just going to simply be interested in it too. So we made it a workshop, opened one hundred seats,

 

Speaker2: [00:44:16] Sold them out, you know,

 

Speaker3: [00:44:18] And now I’m getting paid to create the first part of the framework and you’ll never get it that cheap again. This is going to be a high ticket, so it’s kind of like a win win. And like you said, you know, people in the workshop, we’re doing a three day pop up group. So my people are always engaged when I when I give them face time. And so I have no doubt it’s going to lead

 

Speaker2: [00:44:36] To people

 

Speaker3: [00:44:37] Being interested in the high ticket. We also decide it for

 

Speaker2: [00:44:41] The like the middle

 

Speaker3: [00:44:42] Rung of our ladder. It’s called the Empower Business Lab, which is like the self study. There is some support in the group will be nothing like the there’s not like dedicated coaches and stuff like you would get in high ticket. We decided this August which when this airs, it will have already happened. So we’ll see how it turns out you guys are here. It’s kind of like going to be backwards, be talking about it. But I’m curious what you’re going to think about this because it’s kind of been a little bit of like all the rage lately.

 

Speaker2: [00:45:07] We’re going to do what people

 

Speaker3: [00:45:09] Would coin as a paid challenge, but we are not calling it a challenge. I don’t like the word challenge. I think it’s like a stopper word, you know, it’s like it indicates it’s going to be hard. We don’t want it to be hard.

 

Speaker2: [00:45:18] We want to be fun.

 

Speaker3: [00:45:19] And so we’re calling it an

 

Speaker2: [00:45:20] Experience, but it’s not

 

Speaker3: [00:45:22] The cost of a workshop. We’re going to do early bird at nineteen dollars for a week and a half, and then next week and a half will just go up and our ten dollars will be an order bump for lifetime access. This even might change. But right now, this is the plan. I really feel like when people are pay, they’re more likely to show up and be engaged. And so your back end conversions are higher. And I’m really curious how it will play out compared to like this workshop model because it’s not quite the same, but it is similar. So it’s going to be it’s going to be interesting, I don’t know if you have any thoughts on like that, like being lower priced or if you’ve seen it work for any of your clients or anything like that.

 

Speaker4: [00:45:58] So I one client who has been doing pay challenges now for a couple of years and the first one she did was nine nine dollars,

 

Speaker2: [00:46:09] I think, and she had this

 

Speaker4: [00:46:10] Insane conversion rate into her membership. Ok, I want to say she spent in total five thousand on her at this. No, no. She I mean, she made money off of the paid challenge. There was there was an order bomb, blah blah blah. This time she had much bigger goals. So we did the numbers. We calculated a much lower conversion rate, much lower. The pay challenge

 

Speaker2: [00:46:38] Was nineteen

 

Speaker4: [00:46:39] Dollars, I think, and we helped her spend fifty thousand wow on ads. Yeah, and she made money, but she didn’t have the percentage ROI that she did the first time. But it was kind of like that getting paid to grow your list, which is sort of my whole thing, because then she’s going to open up her like certification

 

Speaker2: [00:47:03] In a couple

 

Speaker4: [00:47:03] Of months and now she has all these leads. I think she got sixteen hundred people into the pay challenge. And yeah, well,

 

Speaker3: [00:47:12] Yeah, two thousand in Aspen. So yeah,

 

Speaker4: [00:47:14] Fifty thousand and I’d spent and I think I think like cash

 

Speaker2: [00:47:17] In hand

 

Speaker4: [00:47:18] Revenue was only eighty five thousand. But then there’s the recurring because it’s a membership. So it’s like, OK, I know she was hoping for a higher return on investment immediately, but if you sort of look at it from the like, this

 

Speaker2: [00:47:32] Is just growing the

 

Speaker4: [00:47:33] List before the certification and like a fun way because her challenge is so fun. Yeah, it’s great. So just like I mean, I think all

 

Speaker2: [00:47:42] I’ll say, as

 

Speaker4: [00:47:43] I’m sure you know, is like, what is the. The CPA that you’re going to go for, and is it more important

 

Speaker2: [00:47:50] For you to get numbers in

 

Speaker4: [00:47:52] Or to have a like a low CPA? Cpa has cost per acquisition. So if you have to spend

 

Speaker2: [00:47:58] Point twenty five

 

Speaker4: [00:47:59] Dollars to

 

Speaker2: [00:48:00] Get the nineteen

 

Speaker4: [00:48:01] Dollar sale, how does that work for you as you scale?

 

Speaker3: [00:48:04] Yeah, that’s actually a really good point.

 

Speaker2: [00:48:06] Well, we’ve always had profitable launches.

 

Speaker3: [00:48:08] I’ve always been conservative with my ad spend. So like, we had our first six figure

 

Speaker2: [00:48:12] Launch in April, which

 

Speaker3: [00:48:14] Prior to this airing, I will have actually finally recorded the podcast about it, which I put off forever. It actually was one of the hardest mindset launches we had.

 

Speaker2: [00:48:25] Funny how that works, but

 

Speaker3: [00:48:27] We crossed the six figure mark. We spent 17 grand in ads, so I am not that person ever. That’s like I have great launches, but I spent I’m not that person. Like, we are profitable because, you know, I’m not doing this. If I’m not profitable, I’m very open about that. I mean, they’re making money for my family and supporting my employees and or we’re not doing it like, you know,

 

Speaker2: [00:48:46] So it is

 

Speaker3: [00:48:47] Going to be interesting. It gave me something to mull on how much I want to put up for Facebook ads this time and what that

 

Speaker2: [00:48:52] Means because

 

Speaker3: [00:48:54] We’re not going to get as many people. I mean, we’d have to assume we’re not going get. We had three thousand five hundred people in the challenge in April, so I’d have to pull. I have all the numbers in the spreadsheet, but you know, we had three thousand five hundred people in and I want to say we had like a two point five percent conversion rate, which is not bad, but we don’t know what the benchmark we should be going for when it’s paid. That’s the wild card, that is the wild card. So we’ve never done it before, you know? And so it’s almost like when we’re trying, we’re trying to set our goals the other day for how many people do we want to pay for the experience? But it’s like, Well, what are we predicting a 15 percent conversion rate? Wouldn’t we all love that, you

 

Speaker2: [00:49:31] Know, but it’s not going to

 

Speaker4: [00:49:33] Happen? She had a nine percent conversion rate,

 

Speaker3: [00:49:35] Which is that we can both agree that is

 

Speaker4: [00:49:39] Good, you know? Yes.

 

Speaker3: [00:49:41] So I mean, I definitely anticipate the conversion rate being higher than it was for the free version of the challenge. And we are revamping the content and stuff. But you know, for a long time,

 

Speaker2: [00:49:52] I get stuck in my own head and

 

Speaker3: [00:49:54] I’m resistant to change. And I’m like, I just I get burned out and it’s like, I don’t want to do a new, new way of launching what’s going to do it the way we’ve done it. But you know what?

 

Speaker2: [00:50:02] I don’t know what God got into

 

Speaker3: [00:50:04] Me, and I was just like, I’m sick of doing the same old thing. I want different results and I want to be the person that Tess. And so, you know, we’re running the workshop and this experience like back to back, which is a little nutty. I don’t know why I decided to do that, but we’ll see. We’ll see how it goes.

 

Speaker4: [00:50:22] This is kind of like a question I would

 

Speaker2: [00:50:24] Ask on my show, but

 

Speaker4: [00:50:26] Do you know? And most honestly, most business owners do not know this, so I’m not trying to like, throw, you know? Do you know what the ROI was on that 17 case specifically

 

Speaker2: [00:50:38] Like

 

Speaker4: [00:50:39] Of the people who came in from those ads, what their conversion rate was? Was it also two point five percent?

 

Speaker3: [00:50:46] Ok, so here’s the hard part with marrying that up. This is what I do know my Opt-In always has a tripwire behind it. So we were profitable, slightly profitable with the tripwire. We track all of that even if it doesn’t report into ads manager because I have a whole separate funnel that runs for Facebook.

 

Speaker4: [00:51:04] That’s what I like to hear.

 

Speaker3: [00:51:06] Yes. So I’m pretty good at knowing this. But the hardest part is. Didn’t I talk about black ups when I was on your show and you’re like, Be lookups? Yeah, yeah, you did. Ok, so we did do, and I have to go and look because we take the form that they come in from the Facebook ad to the people who bought. But it always throws us off because, you know, those people who are on your list three to four times three to four email addresses. So it’s not.

 

Speaker2: [00:51:32] Perfect.

 

Speaker3: [00:51:34] But I want to say we out of those leads, it was like for some reason the number one thousand one hundred and eighty one leads is sticking out to me. I don’t know why. Because I was looking at the spreadsheet not too long ago. That’s what we got through Facebook ads. And so, you know, but the exact number of the buyers that came through that funnel is a little murky because of this whole. And, you know, people often have like my think of this school’s been around since twenty sixteen. So I have people on my think giving school. I have like nine accounts, you know, and it’s just so hard to marry that up. And it’s painful. But yeah, so that’s something I have to dig a little further in because that can be look up it and all that stuff.

 

Speaker4: [00:52:12] But yeah, it’s never it’s never perfect. I think the only reason I I bring that up is just sort of to bring awareness to the whole like, once again, that might be you’re like two point five percent might be an average of like a higher conversion rate from your already like your existing warm audience or like semi warm against slightly lower with like stone cold. But I love that you have separate funnels. I love that you’re making the money back on the trip wire. It’s amazing.

 

Speaker2: [00:52:43] Yeah, that’s like my students.

 

Speaker3: [00:52:45] I do want to move because we I have positioned ads. It is not the main deliverable of what I teach now. We I’m good at it, so we have it as a bonus. It’s an option for them to feed their funnel.

 

Speaker2: [00:52:56] But like it is not

 

Speaker3: [00:52:57] A core deliverable of my program. One of the main things I am constantly repeating is you are building the funnel twice and you’re just duplicating everything. Make it part of your process.

 

Speaker2: [00:53:11] It will.

 

Speaker3: [00:53:11] Your life is just so much better when you do that.

 

Speaker4: [00:53:16] Let’s get tattoos. Let’s do that. Duplicate the funnel.

 

Speaker3: [00:53:20] Probably learned it from you, Claire. I mean, I don’t I don’t remember exactly where it came from, but like, let’s be real. I clearly have been following you closely for a while, so it likely came from you.

 

Speaker4: [00:53:31] It’s all good. You know, it’s it’s funny like, you think it’s something everyone’s doing and they are just like, Oh, no, is that new? It’s just duplicate.

 

Speaker3: [00:53:40] I should have VIDEO.

 

Speaker4: [00:53:41] Got to make a video.

 

Speaker3: [00:53:43] I wonder if like that would be a good lead in for you, for your stuff?

 

Speaker4: [00:53:47] Oh, well, here’s the thing I won’t make the video until I actually test it with that

 

Speaker3: [00:53:54] And that

 

Speaker4: [00:53:54] New policy,

 

Speaker3: [00:53:56] I can guarantee you my students will start hearing. So, Claire said. And I think that’s because, you know, I really do. I think that’s a very smart, very smart idea. Now at this point, my program is for lower priced digital products. So it’s a little I’m not dealing with students right now that are launching fourteen hundred products, and it’s a little bit different.

 

Speaker2: [00:54:16] But you know, it’s still a good point. Ok, well, this is I

 

Speaker3: [00:54:20] Always love talking to you.

 

Speaker4: [00:54:21] So, yeah,

 

Speaker3: [00:54:23] Thank you for coming on the show where,

 

Speaker2: [00:54:25] Ok, I know people

 

Speaker3: [00:54:26] Are going to love you as much as I love you. So what is the best way to find you and connect?

 

Speaker4: [00:54:32] Oh gosh, I don’t even know. I mean, come listen to my podcast since you’re already in your podcast app. Just like search. Get paid, Claire. That’s going to be the easiest way to find it in your favorite app. And then if you are like, Well, I want to learn how to test the top of my funnel before I actually build it. Just head over to Claire Pelz and you’re going to see a couple of different options to work with us. The one I recommend for basically for Monica’s students, if you’ve worked with Monica

 

Speaker2: [00:55:00] Already, come and join

 

Speaker4: [00:55:02] Us inside the lead lab. That’s our coaching plus training program and where I may or may not want to get on the back end of your ads manager, at least, at least on our calls.

 

Speaker3: [00:55:13] Yes. Yeah. If you I would agree of students at work with me, you’ll definitely love Claire. I mean, and for Facebook ads, absolutely like without without you, I I don’t know where I’d be probably still trying to blog and make it organic traffic. Thank God, that’s not the case anymore.

 

Speaker4: [00:55:32] And if you do come after listening to this podcast, please let me know so I can give Monica some affiliate money. I mean, she didn’t ask. She didn’t ask. But like, I’m going to have to send something.

 

Speaker3: [00:55:44] Oh, well, thank you. Thank you so much for coming on. This is really fun. It was my pleasure. Thanks for having me.

 

Speaker1: [00:55:50] Thanks for tuning in to another episode of the Empowered Business podcast. If you want to get started creating your own digital products and don’t know where to start, we have a brand new training that can help. It’s called The Passion to Profit How to discover your unique million dollar digital product formula. Head on over to empowered business DPKO for profit to join the training for free. Plus, we’ve added on a private podcast feed to make consuming the content even easier. You can choose to consume it via video or a private podcast feed. I can’t wait to see you back here next week.

 

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